Victorian Families and Genealogy

[EMDEE]

When I was in Campbeltown last week I was given details of the family of my great-great grandparents. Everyone has 8 sets of g.g.grandparents, but these were my maternal grandmother’s maternal grandparents, who married in 1842. I had no previous knowledge of this couple or their progeny.

The most striking thing about the chart that I have is the size of the families. This couple had ten children who between them produced 81 grandchildren, one of whom was obviously my grandmother.

Families of this size were by no means unique in former times.

My grandmother alone went on to have a family of seven, and it is interesting to speculate as to how many descendants even this Victorian couple alone now have.

It also leads me to think that there is an even higher level of common ancestry and kinship in Kintyre than I already knew about.

I wonder how many forum members are related to each other (albeit distantly) without even knowing it?

[SARID]

My Father, brought up in Carradale,had a cousin on The Paternal side
of his family.She married my Granny's brother, and was then the Mother
of my Father'smaternal cousins.
Therefore,his cousins were also his cousins once removed-----I think!!

[Mary G]

Hi EMDEE

Fascinating stuff, that genealogy ... though sometimes you might regret finding out who you are related to

My sister has virtually made a career of such research - for both our own family, and that of her husband - also a native of Kintyre. She has got many branches right back to the late 1600's. A lot of time is spent figuring out where some of these descendents are now - because the trail can go cold. Very interesting and rewarding work - especially for the rest of us who find out amazing things about the family without the hours of effort!

There has been so much migration out of the area, especially in the early 18th Century (say from 1720 to 1750), but that drain of people away from the area has been relentless - only the rate has changed. And then there was the 'plantation' of lowland farmers too, and migration from Ireland too. I suspect that the gene pool is more diverse than one would imagine.

Angus Martin's books, and the one that came out a couple of years ago entitled 'Campbeltown', have got a lot of interesting content on the subject.

Let me know if you want to exchange family tree details with my sister.

[EMDEE]

Let me know if you want to exchange family tree details with my sister.

I've sent a PM.

[EMDEE]

My Father, brought up in Carradale,had a cousin on The Paternal side
of his family.She married my Granny's brother, and was then the Mother
of my Father'smaternal cousins.
Therefore,his cousins were also his cousins once removed-----I think!!

I too have relatives that I am related to on both sides, but not quite as closely as that!

[westport321]

the frustrating part of those families that I found, was that they all had the same 1st names, so tracking children from brothers is a nightmare.Still trying to figure out all the different groups and which father they came from. Gets really bad when they marry into 1st and 2nd cousins with the same last name and very close birthdates, Anyone got any hints on how to seperate them???

[cgms310]

Hello Westport!

Having been down the road you now travel, I can tell you it is no easy feat, when trying to determine which Andrew, or Archibald, or Mary is which!

Obviously the most helpful detail is the actual date of birth. Parental marriage dates also help greatly.

On the subject of children, what you must also remember is many of them sadly died before reaching the age of 5. What makes matters worse is that often a name would be "revived" and so two children with the same name would appear in two census records some ten years apart with the same name and similar age! I have found that deep research into burial records can also by VERY helpful in determining who survived and who did not.

There are many sites that will help you and if you need further assistance, just drop me an e-mail at replycs@yahoo.ca

Regards,



Charles.

[Tosh]

My Father, brought up in Carradale,had a cousin on The Paternal side
of his family.She married my Granny's brother, and was then the Mother
of my Father'smaternal cousins.
Therefore,his cousins were also his cousins once removed-----I think!!

I expect we're all related to most of Carradale
My Granddad and his brother married sisters making their kids double cousins.

[Tosh]

Hi EMDEE

Fascinating stuff, that genealogy ... though sometimes you might regret finding out who you are related to

My sister has virtually made a career of such research - for both our own family, and that of her husband - also a native of Kintyre. She has got many branches right back to the late 1600's. A lot of time is spent figuring out where some of these descendents are now - because the trail can go cold. Very interesting and rewarding work - especially for the rest of us who find out amazing things about the family without the hours of effort!

I got into researching my family tree 5 years ago while killing time waiting for my youngest to be born.
I managed to get back as far as 1666 in the town but not on the 'tosh side.
the Scotland's people website and the LDS site are very useful.
I'd still like to find out more about the McIntosh line and when exactly they arrived in the village and by what route.
My other main line of interest is the Campbell line but as you can imagine sometimes you can't see the wood for the trees on that one.

[EMDEE]

My late uncle (mother’s brother) traced the McShannon ancestry back to 1505. This was done some years ago, pre internet, and was researched through local records and sources, and a lot of time and effort. He also found two earlier instances of the name in 1456 and 1371.

Using the internet, I spent one afternoon and traced my paternal line back to 1794 in Campbeltown. That is as far as I have gone on that side. I’ll have to take up that search again. I think they are relative newcomers to Kintyre compared with my mother’s family!

[cgms310]

For anyone who would like the old records from 1596 to 1606, I do have a .pdf file with the basic content from a section of a book called "Papers Relating To Kintyre". This file was sent to me by one of my Australian cousins, who got a copy from the local library.

It is a tough read (26 pages), written in old English, a wee bit of Latin and some Gaelic thrown in for good measure, but the content names the individuals who had lands or worked land for the Duke of Argyll. I think the Duke at the time had been executed for treason, and the author and his companions were representing King James.

Detail includes land size and fees, original farm names (I assume) and other tidbits of information.

I cannot post it on the forum as I am sure there are copyright issues, but I would be happy to send it as an e-mail attachment to any of the Kintyre Forum members, so just PM me your e-mail details and it's yours.

Regards,


Charles.

[EMDEE]

That would be a very interesting document for anyone interested in local history.

[cgms310]

I received a few requests!

Please let me know that you received your copies OK.

Regards,



Charles.

[EMDEE]

Thanks to Charles for making this document available. It ties in very well, and gives a background to "Kintyre in the 17th Century" by Andrew McKerral. On an initial scan of this document, I have been able to pick out some of my own ancestors. Much of it is written in Old Scots and can be diffficult to understand, but it is worth the effort.

[cgms310]

Thank you EMDEE,

It is the least I could do after the kindness shown to me by the membership of the Kintyre Forum.

Have a wonderul weekend!


Charles.