The Lochgelly Tawse

[EMDEE]

Did I hear someone call for the return to the Strap?

Not the strap, but the Jock Strap's a different matter.

[JamesT]

The "belt" in Scotland was a cruel abuse that was allowed to continue for far too long. A misguided saddler in Fife had been allowed, and even encouraged, to produce straps of such fearsome thickness and density that their effective use was nothing less than child torture. And these were used in the vast majority of Scottish schools including illegally, against the local authority’s wishes, in Glasgow. The pain was unbelievable and agonising, and could be continued for up to six strokes, when the first one or two had already rendered the child's hands swollen and contused, and the recipient in shock and extreme pain. It is hard to credit now, thirty years on, but just to see and feel the weight of one of these implements is shocking. And in some schools they were in daily and almost random use as a punishment of first resort. In the hands of sadists (and sadly there were too many of those) it was effectively torture. And new teachers were drawn into the foolish practice, even at a time when after the supposed 'liberation' of the sixties it should have been clear to any rational person that it was an unacceptable anachronism. Here is the story of one silly wee lassie who joined in with some apparent enthusiasm and still feels no shame:

http://blethers.blogspot.com/2009/01/co ... ffort.html

Back then, the worst thing was to let your friends see that you 'couldnae take it', but now we're in our 40s and 50s and older, it's time to stop pretending 'it didnae dae me ony hairm' and show this up for what it was - plain and simple abuse. And it's not too late to name and shame some of the worst perpetrators.

[Bobbie En Tejas]

The main thing that upsets me is I never fully appreciated the merits of being beaten by middle aged women with leather straps when I was a juvenile. The kind of entertainment I'm having to pay good hard cash for these days

PS. If you see Mrs Sheik, I'm only joking!

[Govangirl]

JamesT, I certainly agree with you. I was shocked when I was awarded my belt as a new teacher and vowed I would never use it.
But if Sheik wants a go now I'll be happy to oblige!

[petewick]

In my experience, the level of pain was dependent on how hungover
the person giving the belt was!

[LANDROVER ROGER]

I remember that the teachers at my school used a variety of implements.Doubled up length of bunsen tubing,rubber strap from beneath chairs,plimsolls,belt and of course the cane.Sadistic bunch.

[bassett]

Never did any lasting harm,and I should know, as I had more than my fair share of the belt.

[JamesT]

It would be interesting to understand how you "know" that, bassett, in relation to

(a)yourself;
(b) others.

And whatever the end result, violence is not justified, especially violence perpetrated by educated adults on defenceless children in their 'care'. The heavy Lochgelly straps were capable of inflicting pain that went far beyond anything that could be considered moderate and reasonable. It is a national disgrace that the whistle was not blown on it long before it was - and that is not to start to go into the motives of some of the people who battered children with these implements, or the nature of the satisfaction they derived from thrashing and beating them. There is an abuse scandal here, as much as the extreme cases in some of the children's homes and approved schools, that is yet to be given a proper public airing.

The "belt" was used too often for minor offences, it was used excessively, it was used by people who should never had permission to beat children, and it blighted the lives of many decent youngsters through fear, even if they never experienced it themselves in its worst form. The practice degraded the person wielding the tawse, and the recipient, and the spectators.

Can you imagine if there had been mobile phones with cameras back then, and the internet? Suppose an ordinary classroom belting, let alone a severe one, had been secretly filmed and shown on youtube. There would have been outrage. It will never return, and thank God for that.

[bassett]

Can you imagine if there had been mobile phones with cameras back then, and the internet? Suppose an ordinary classroom belting, let alone a severe one, had been secretly filmed and shown on youtube. There would have been outrage. It will never return, and thank God for that.

No,I cannot imagine that.That is the whole point,it was a different time then,and I for one often wonder when I look at the world today if it was not a lot better then.

[JamesT]

Well, try this then. If a typical school belting were to have been inflicted on a detainee at Abu Graibh or similar, it would have (rightly) been condemned as torture and the perpetrators subject to prosecution. Why should we think for a moment that such treatment is perfectly acceptable for a Scottish schoolchild?

As for the comparison of "then" and "now", we live in a more enlightened and civilised society now than we did then, and that has been the inexorable direction of post-Industrial Revolution history. That that presents challenges to society, and demands higher degrees of competence adn professionalism from people like schoolteachers is how it should be - the day when they could get by on the fear of violence has gone, and good riddance.

There have always been rose-tinted harkings back to the "good old days", and they have always been wrong. The real stupidity is that this barbaric practice was tolerated into the 1980s. That was down to the inadequacy and foolishness of a proportion of the teaching profession and the cowardice of politicians. It took a couple of brave mothers standing up for their rights, and the civilising influence of the wider European community, to finally push them over the edge into the dustbin of history where they belong.

[EMDEE]

JamesT

Reading between the lines, I think you would like to see a procession of elderly retired teachers appearing in court for their misdeeds of several decades ago. I too find it unbelievable that this practice was tolerated in Scotland in such recent times, and was on the recieving end of it on many occasions. In these days, the teacher was the prosecutor, judge and jury rolled into one, and I know that there were many miscarriages of justice, where the teacher "got hold of the wrong end of the stick" about an incident, and believed the wrong people (i.e.malicious "clipes") with their own agenda of getting certain individuals into trouble. Did any of these teachers think that they were being manipulated?

I also find it difficult to comprehend that these educated professional people felt that it was acceptable that they used this as a sanction against school pupils, without considering that it demeaned their professional status. As far as gaining them respect from pupils was concerned, if I remember correctly, it was fear rather than respect, which is not a particularly good basis for a productive pupil/teacher relationship.

[Govangirl]

You're right Emdee. Those teachers who wielded the belt ruled by fear and those we respected didn't need it. Still, despite the distaste I have for corporal punishment, the idea that:

the day when they could get by on the fear of violence has gone

has now gone full circle - don't you agree James? It's many teachers who now live in fear of pupil violence (or their parents, for that matter!)

[EMDEE]

Apparently the business of producing these weapons was started by a saddler by the name of Philps, then was taken over by a Mr Dick, whose family owned the business for three generations until it became illegal. Three generations of Dicks? Appropriate or not?

[JamesT]

Not necessarily elderly and retired, Emdee, some of their newly-qualified colleagues who took it up with enthusiasm in the 1970s and right through into the 1980s may be hale and hearty and still in the classroom. We're not talking all that long ago - less than thirty years. But no, I don't want to see them in court (unless there were specific instances of serious abuse that went far beyond anything deemed 'acceptable' at the time.) But I would like some sort of public airing of it all, perhaps along sort of 'truth and reconciliation' lines, to make clear just how wrong it all was and to bring some closure to some of the victims who are now in their 40s, 50s and older.

I can see your point, Govangirl, but I don't agree with 'full circle'. Sure, a more tolerant and civilised society bring stresses and challenges, and we have failed to give as much support as we should to helping all families to develop positively, particularly at the 'early years' stage to avoid some of the anti-social consequences further down the line. It's not easy, but resorting to punitive violence is not a solution, not now and should not have been in the 1970s.

But i don't think the typical schoolteacher lives 'in fear of violence' in the way you suggest. Here's what a head of a major comprehensive in Edinburgh, one not without its share of social problems, said about this issue recently:

"1982 was the year I started my teaching career. This was the year the belt stopped being used in Scottish classrooms. At the time, I recall many in the profession expressing fear that this would be the end of schooling as we know it and that our Education system would go into terminal decline. In my view this could not have been further from the truth. The staff entering the profession in the past few years are products of a system that did not rely on belting young people with a piece of leather to maintain control and order. It is my view that these are young professionals who develop higher order skills to create the atmosphere in their classroom that allows learning to flourish.

By way of example,in the past two days, I have had the pleasure of observing two of our excellent younger staff (Ms T in English and Ms W in French) in the classroom. The lessons I saw were first class. A number of things really impressed me. Firstly, both displayed an excellent rapport with the pupils. Both had excellent classroom control; all pupils did as they were supposed to do. Anyone who stepped out of line was gently and skilfully brought back 'on task'. It was clear to me that the pupils in the classes were engaged and active learners, not because they were fearful of the consequences, but because they were sufficiently motivated and stimulated by their teachers to want to do well.

It will come as no surprise to anyone that I am wholly convinced that the best teachers are the ones who develop excellent relationships with their charges. That is not to say that the best teachers are 'friends' with the pupils. What really matters is developing a professional relationship with pupils where a common set of values are shared, expectations are sky-high and where respect is always two way."

What an excellent chap. Would that the profession thirty years ago had had more like that.

[bill]

Memories of happy teen years in the Grammar.A trainee teacher trying to give you the belt ,and you opened your arms wide each time she/he took a swipe.

As a previous poster has stated"Didn't do me any harm".I sure as hell don't need closure .