Sir James Saville

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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby Sheik Yir Erse » Fri Nov 09, 2012 9:38 pm

There's lots of nasty sites on the net, not sure I'd be happy posting links to them just because they 'are out there'

So what are your thoughts on it, you obviously brought it to people's attention for a reason?
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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby LANDROVER ROGER » Fri Nov 09, 2012 9:42 pm

Just to expand on what is "out there".No other reason.
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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby Sheik Yir Erse » Fri Nov 09, 2012 9:47 pm

So you suddenly don't have an opinion? Bottle merchant :wink:
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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby LANDROVER ROGER » Fri Nov 09, 2012 11:46 pm

No need for that Sheik.I just posted something that I found for generall Forum viewing to expand the subject.No other reason.
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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby odds » Sat Nov 10, 2012 12:21 am

So, the first sign of possible wrongdoings by a prominent politician at the time, and suddenly the 'STAR' witness backs down and says it was mistaken identity. So just how does he think he will be able to identify the true offenders, and could his evidence be trusted ?
The rich/powerfull, if involved in any of this have nothing to fear, as they have just been shown the way to defend themselves. As has happened in the past everything will be glossed over very nicely, if you know the right people :)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20269114

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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby democat101 » Sun Nov 11, 2012 2:58 pm

UK Column Live
http://www.ukcolumn.org/video/uk-column ... ember-2012
Brian Gerrish and Patrick Henningsen present a UK Column Live special covering paedophila in the establishment, the BBC cover-up, and tw interviews with Robert Green presenting definitive evidence of the abuse of Downs Syndrome girl, Hollie Greig.
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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby four eyes » Mon Nov 12, 2012 5:26 pm

none of this is going away, no matter how hard they try to discredit the victims, spread misinformation etc.
The Jillings report: How the truth about North Wales child abuse scandal was suppressed
Council insurers demanded that the first full investigation into the care home scandal was pulped. Roger Dobson – who has one of the few remaining copies – details an astonishing cover-up
ROGER DOBSON SUNDAY 11 NOVEMBER 2012

A damning report that laid bare the North Wales child abuse scandal might have aired the issue of sex attacks on children in care nearly half a decade before an official judicial inquiry in 2000.

Instead copies of the report were ordered to be destroyed because the council that commissioned it feared it might be sued, The Independent on Sunday can reveal. Only a handful remain, including one obtained by this newspaper.

The suppressed report, by a panel of experts led by former social services chief John Jillings, outlined the widespread abuse of children in care, some as young as 10, years before the tribunal chaired by High Court judge Sir Ronald Waterhouse reported.

The copy held by The IoS shows:

* The then newly appointed North Wales chief constable, who was uncontactable yesterday, refused to meet them or help with access to the police major-incident database. "We were disappointed at the apparent impossibility of obtaining a breakdown of data. We are unable to identify the overall extent of the allegations received by the police in the many witness statements which they took.''

* Some 130 boxes of material handed over by the council to the police were not made available to the panel.

* The council did not allow the inquiry to place a notice in the local press seeking information. "This was considered to be unacceptable to the insurers,'' says the report.

While the report went unpublished, coverage of the scandal by this newspaper eventually helped to set up the Waterhouse review, which reported in 2000. Mr Jillings, a respected independent social services expert, was succinct yesterday about what he had found out back then: "What we found was horrific and on a significant scale. If the events in children's homes in North Wales were to be translated into a film, Oliver Twist would seem relatively benign." The scale of what happened, and how it was allowed, he said, "are a disgrace, and stain on the history of child care in this country."

Some 300 pages were compiled in the face of fierce opposition and obstruction: Mr Jillings and his team – Professor Jane Tunstall and Gerrilyn Smith – were so frustrated they almost quit. The results were pulped: one of the few remaining copies has now been sent to the Children's Commissioner for Wales, Keith Towler. According to the report, the insurers – Municipal Mutual – suggested the chair of the council's social services committee, Malcolm King, be sacked if he spoke out: "Draconian as it may seem, you may have to consider with the elected members whether they wish to remove him from office if he insists on having the freedom to speak."

Mr King yesterday described the report's suppression as the destruction of an effective weapon against abuse: "Because it was suppressed, the lessons of the Jillings report were not learned. It was the exchange of financial safety for the safety of real people. It was one of the most shameful parts of recent history."

Mr Jillings's report paints an alarming picture of a system in which physical and sexual violence were common, from beatings and bullying, to indecent assault and rape. Some staff linked to abuse may have been allowed to resign or retire early.

Children's carers were recruited without proper references, without application forms, and, in one case, with a rugby club acting as a contact point for vacancies. Children who complained of abuse were not believed, or worse, punished for making false allegations.

The report also revealed that its members had considered quitting: "As the constraints emerged, the panel considered whether it could continue or abandon its investigations," it said. "We determined to continue despite the very considerable constraints placed upon us.'' From the outset there was difficulty and confusion over access to files.

Despite such obstructions they stuck to their brief to investigate child care in Clwyd in the wake of a number of allegations and court cases involving carers. Most of the allegations covered the period 1980 to 1988, and a four-year police inquiry saw 2,600 statements taken and 300 cases sent to the Crown Prosecution Service. Eventually eight men were charged, and six convicted. The panel was tasked with looking at what had gone wrong, reviewing practices, and making recommendations for change.

After reviewing internal reports and interviewing more than 70 witnesses, the picture that emerged was one of dysfunctional homes where children were abused sexually and physically. "It is the opinion of the panel that extensive and widespread abuse has occurred within Clwyd residential establishments for children and young people," they concluded. How many were abused is not clear, but estimates range up to 200. In the 1990s, around 150 had already sought compensation.

"The most striking fact to emerge is that five men who shared in common their employment as residential care workers at the Bryn Estyn home were convicted of serious offences involving at least 25 young people. Twenty of the victims were boys, five were girls. The age range was 10 to 16. Many of the allegations involving these men consisted of specimen charges; many others were left on the file,'' they reported.

There were allegations of widespread physical abuse, sometimes with care workers inflicting gratuitous violence, others involving other boys being used to attack victims. The report also says it was common practice for staff to take residents home for the weekend.

Staff recruitment was frequently chaotic. "In some cases references were provided which were barely adequate as recommendations for employment. There appears to have been no application forms in a disturbing number of cases. More than one staff member described the recruitment process as taking people off the street.''

There was also a culture of silence. "At Bryn Estyn, professional misgivings were discouraged and complaints viewed as disloyal. As a consequence, abusive and dangerous practices escalated out of control and unchecked.'' The report denounced those who should have stopped the abuse, saying: "Our findings show that time and again, the response to indications that children may have been abused has been too little and too late."

A key issue in North Wales has been whether there was a paedophile ring at work. One internal Clwyd council report from the time – like Jillings, unpublished – said: "There remain worrying current instances of conviction and prosecution for sexual offences of persons who are known to have worked together in child care establishments both in the county [Clwyd] and in other parts of the north-west,'' it said.

"These suggest, that abuse could have been happening unabated for many years and, that there could be operating a league or ring of paedophiles who help one another find sources and situations where abuse can be perpetrated and the addiction fed.''

There were allegations too of abusers outside the care system: "There were numerous claims and suggestions that senior public figures including the police and political figures might have been involved in the abuse of young people,'' the report said.
despite concerted efforts to keep information out of the public domain, there are many who realise the true nature of this beast.
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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby four eyes » Mon Nov 12, 2012 5:37 pm

this is an interesting piece for those who may be intrigued as to how the cover-up is being worked.
Attempt to Erase Pedophilia: BBC and Gov’t Operatives Still Hoping To Stop Hemorrhaging of Public Confidence


Nicholas Myra
21st Century Wire
Guest Columnist

A disturbing shift has occurred over the weekend in Britain.

A very noticeable pressure has been building against Britain’s elite establishment composed of politicians, highly paid media executives and celebrities, over the ugly issue of pedophilia and child abuse – a crime which has, for generations, been allowed to be carried out in secret.

Since Friday’s assessment of David Cameron’s most embarrassing TV challenge by seemingly harmless personality Philip Schofield, the whole national conversation is now being engineered by Downing Street and top media executives, to rotate away from Jimmy Savile and MP Tom Watson’s call for a rooting out of organized pedophilia in government – and over to protecting the allegedly fragile reputations of hereditary elites like Lord McAlpine, who according to major newspaper editors and TV pundits, have suddenly become victims of a ‘witch-hunt’ for paedophiles.


Lord McApline: “I never abused children’.
Following a rather obvious, internally staged damage control event, where the embattled BBC Director General George Entwistle went on BBC Breakfast Show and the Radio Four Live programs to fall on his sword for ‘bad journalism’ over last week’s Newsnight set-up – Entwistle resigns. Now the government are crying witch-hunt. It’s an attempt to apply a new spin to the old spin, where the public are now expected to feel sorry for Lord McAlpine and any other ‘proper person’ like him, for being accused of child abuse, or pedophilia.

This is the latest effort by Downing Street spin doctors and certain media executives and hired writers, to shut down any serious debate on paedophiles in power, and close the doors on any more fruitful external or internal investigations.

They really hope to end it here with Jimmy Savile and Sir Peter Morrison, and maybe throw in the clown Gary Glitter for good measure.

Unfortunately, that’s not going to happen. Why? Because when it comes to its children, parents nationwide will not accept the standard government cover-up inquiry and perverting the course of justice. The nation will not let go of this issue, because it’s out there, and because 9 out of 10 plebs agree that pedophiles should be eradicated from all public institutions.

Up until this week, the major media gatekeepers were locked into a spiraling narrative which they could not escape because the implications towards the people involved threatened to entire power structure – because they are very afraid about what people will find out. In their dark world of cloak and dagger, the most coveted prize of all is dirt. It’s the most valuable form of currency behind the scenes. Newspaper editors, executives, TV producers, police, MI5, lawyers, MPs, Ministers and gangsters are constantly trafficking in information about each other in order to gain an advantage. In this black market of classified information, reports of pedophilia, child abuse – and also homosexuality, are as good as gold.

The key word here is classified.



David Aaronovitch published his column in the Times on Thurs Nov 8, 2012, entitled, ‘Beware of a modern Salem over child abuse’. This was 24 hours before another intellectual giant, Prime Minister David Cameron went on national TV and cried ‘witch-hunt’ when ambushed by housewife pin-up Schofield. Predictably, Aaronvitch has led the charge calling for the sacking of Philip Schofield on LBC Radio. Aaronovitch also stating on air that some of the allegations against Jimmy Savile “may not be true”, quite a shocking sympathetic stance regarding the nation’s worse-ever one child abuser. Pretty shocking.

Aaronovitch’s ‘witch-hunt’ is a rather hysterical claim. Yet, it’s hard to believe that the great and the good would be crying scared so much to scream “witch-hunt!”, but there you have it. If this scandal wasn’t so serious, I’d be laughing right about now.

On its surface, the new witch-hunt talking point sounds like a desperate establishment meme, from an elite criminal ring who are now in such a panic as to try and equate the very serious and documented problem of organized paedophilia operating through positions of power, in government, the media, the police – and the judiciary, with a sensational event which happened in colonial Massachusetts. No, we have stacks of forensic evidence, and police reports that prove that, unlike witches in Salem, paedophiles in British institutions do actually exist.

Rather ironically, the cause of that old Salem witch hunt was guilty men in power trying to cover-up and silence anyone who dared speak of their heinous crimes.

Paedophiles and sexual deviants in positions of power – is a reality, not a ‘conspiracy theory’, as the Times writer Aaronovitch hoped to define it, by denying it exists. Documents in the Belgium child rape and murder case pointed at the involvement of both Belgium AND Dutch politicians, judiciary and police – all taking part in the Mark Dutroux child abuse scandal, but writers like Aaronovitch will tell you that it’s just another ‘conspiracy theory’. The UK’s police and security services do have reams of evidence, but unfortunately for us the public, most of these crimes are sealed by government D Notices, while the rest are buried through internal institutional investigations.

It was also more than a little disturbing to watch how Aaronovitch is said to have spoken to “a Senior BBC journalist”, whom he claims, like Aaronovitch, was “deeply skeptical” about child abuse victim Steve Messham’s testimony. Notice how David Aaronovitch doesn’t name the journalist, but is clearly using his column to draft a conviction – for all we know, David Aaronovitch could just be making things up to spread false information – just like those pesky internet blogs he says he loathes. Anyhow, I think it’s pretty darn safe to say here that the last person I would call on would be a BBC journalist for a second opinion when it comes to child abuse cases (I cough here).

So here we have senior a Times columnist who appears to be using his column in a national daily newspaper to deliver his own verdict in the North Wales Child Home scandal by trying to convince the public that victim Messham’s testimony was “shaky”. If I didn’t know better, I’d say he has an ulterior motive, maybe ‘moonlighting’ as they say, but it’s really so hard to tell these days who’s who in the world of big money media.


Aaronovitch: Drafted in again to protect the establishment line.
I suppose that Aaronovitch might also be a little upset to know that fixer Sir Jimmy Savile was also acting as a go-between for Israel and Britain.

What was Jimmy up to in Israel? I can tell you this much - it’s no secret in Whitehall. That’s not a conspiracy theory by the way, and as upset as some folks might be about it, you can’t rewrite history.

Moreover, writer David Aaronovitch also made a highly questionable, and arguably insensitive, if not bizarrely inappropriate statement in the same article:

“The unattractive (because complicating) truth is that sometimes people do lie about being abused. Sometimes it’s for money, sometimes for attention, sometimes because that’s what they infer their listeners want to hear. Or fantasy has become solidified as fact, the dream as daylight.”

Pretty shocking stuff. Aaronovitch’s statement about victims ‘fantasizing’ about their abusers, is designed to support his rather disingenuous ‘witch-hunt’ thesis, when it appears a paragraph before his own self-styled verdict on Steve Messham’s ‘shaky’ testimony, and this type of statement in the face of what is clearly a national institutional problem almost looks again like Aaronovitch has been put up to help steer public opinion completely away from a problem. His statement is Salem in reverse. Shame on you David.

Aaronovitch has a history of making some rather ridiculous statements, and then cleverly covering their own tracks.Whether defending the mythology of WMD’s in Iraq (after his pro-war campaigning for Gulf War II, he tries to cover his tracks in 2004 saying, “From the outset of the Iraq debate I was a WMD agnostic”), or defending Israel’s treatment of the Palestinians, Aaronovitch has a pretty shameless record as an establishment gatekeeper, whilst touting some sort of Marxist pedigree. As a former Observer columnist, he is the classic example of a 20th century media-annointed, intelligentsia gatekeeper who typically writes a column per week, appears on the odd panel, looks to be busy by writing a few mediocre history books debunking ‘conspiracy theories’ – and somehow gets paid handsomely for it. His job it seems, is to put his own memes out there into the public conversation in order to get people thinking along received establishment wisdom. The irony here is, when it comes to opinion forming, when it’s all said and done, more people will have read our article here on this website than David Aaronovitch’s piece for the Times – thanks to Rupert Murdoch’s subscription firewall at the Times.co.uk.
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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby WC1 » Mon Nov 12, 2012 5:50 pm

Make him stop, somebody!
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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby WC1 » Mon Nov 12, 2012 6:03 pm

Re Pakalertpress, I notice that among the other information they have on their blog are "reports" that all Americans are to be implanted with a micro-chip in 2013 as part of Obamacare and that Obama gave orders for the control of hurricanes so that Sandy could be brought in to aid his campaign at just the right moment. So it's obviously a reliable source . . .
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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby four eyes » Mon Nov 12, 2012 6:13 pm

WC1 wrote:Make him stop, somebody!

you are not compelled to read this thread. Next time you log on just don't press on this one.

Somebody must be reading it, it has had the most hits of any thread on here in such a short time, I can only hope that there are people out there waking up to the awful truth. Child abuse is a crime, a particularly heinous one, some people do not want to face up to the truth of the matter, some of the perpetrators are rich and powerful,maybe even politicians. They are attempting to discredit victims, muddy the waters, present an alternative viewpoint and generally trying to evade being caught. It is up to us, the public to ensure they don't get away with it.if you find this fact distasteful, or you just don't want to know about it, then don't subscribe to this thread, simple.


here is a link to a blog regarding the disinformation piece in the daily fail.http://ricosorda.blogspot.co.uk/
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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby bill » Mon Nov 12, 2012 9:27 pm

WC1 wrote:Make him stop, somebody!


No problem Willie.At the rate he is cutting and pasting articles the Forum's data base will soon be full. :roll:
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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby gizmo » Mon Nov 12, 2012 9:35 pm

WC1 wrote:Make him stop, somebody!


:lol: :lol:
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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby four eyes » Tue Nov 13, 2012 10:58 am

here a link that explains the Mail deconstruction of the victim in the lord you know who affair. This is the establishment at work trying to bury a story. Make your own minds up,the Daily mail you couldnt make it up! Or could you?
http://tompride.wordpress.com/2012/11/1 ... avid-rose/

http://hat4uk.wordpress.com/ more here.
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Re: Sir James Saville

Postby four eyes » Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:33 pm

as with still attracting plenty of viewers is another link that might interest you.
http://hat4uk.wordpress.com/2012/11/14/ ... d-on-them/
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