Royal Attack

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Re: Royal Attack

Postby Govangirl » Sat Dec 11, 2010 3:06 pm

And Gizmo is right.
But even though everything will never be that pink and fluffy Utopia you describe, I am still glad that my fellow men do not lie down and accept injustice and betrayal. History has proved that.
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Re: Royal Attack

Postby Bertie » Sat Dec 11, 2010 4:31 pm

Much as I admire your passion GG I cannot help but feel there are double standards at play here. I am not denying anyone the right to protest and stand up for what they believe in, on the contrary I would actively encourage it. However what you describe as a bit of paint is someone elses idea of vandalism and what is said to be a bit of damage to a car is pure intimidation and bullying. Are you saying that it's ok to take these actions as long as you think the cause is just and the people that are doing it are students and fighting for the rights of their children? If so I take it you will be equally supportive of the BNP the next time they take to the streets and deploy the same tactics!!

Also, as far as your taxes going to Scottish students.....they don't. At best they form part of the grant that comes to Scotland and the Scottish Executive decide if it goes to Scottish students or not. I'm sure we could all sit here and quote instances of Scottish tax payers money being syphoned off for purely English needs but that would achieve little.

It was interesting to see the Cambridge University student apologising for swinging off a Union Jack on the Cenotaph. He said he was "caught up in the moment" and he didn't realise it was the Cenotaph. By the way he's a history student. There's £9000 a year well spent!!
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Re: Royal Attack

Postby Govangirl » Sat Dec 11, 2010 5:29 pm

Bertie, first, the quip about the BNP was unfair because you know that I am not advocating violence and hooliganism. In all these cases, it is easy to pick out the facts that support your view. Just as I believe that all teenagers are not rude chavs, that all football supporters are not hooligans, that all those on benefits are not lazy scroungers, etc. I also believe that only a minority of these students were violent and moronic. What I objected to was the fact that, as usual, the indignation is with the FEW that caused the trouble instead of the focus being on who really is at fault! Cameron must be laughing up his sleeve at this while Joe Public scorns the students fighting for democracy instead of him.
As Isa pointed out, the police were heavy-handed (although me, I saw them hit the miners a lot harder so they need to step up to the mark a bit more) and where you rightly point out the case of an upper class twit from Cambridge, I am thinking more of the student in hospital with severe head injuries due to being coshed by a truncheon.

Yes, I do support peaceful protests although I am well aware that they achieve nothing. The march against Blair's war proved that. Do I think that anything worthwhile has been achieved through peaceful protest? No - from Cromwell to Mandela, there has been civil disobedience in changing policies for the better. In fact, our whole parliamentary democracy has been built on violence and bloodshed.
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Re: Royal Attack

Postby gizmo » Sat Dec 11, 2010 5:56 pm

I note Cameron is still the cause of the violence. Although charges were first brought in under Labour, increased by the Tories and agreed to by the Lib/Dems. Indeed it appears the BNP are the only ones you appear to be in agreement with. :D
I suppose you are right that only a few of the students were violent thugs and indeed the police were all heavy handed monsters. :roll:
Does going to Cambridge automatically make you an upper class twit? For someone who agrees protest marches change nothing, you seem to batter on with the same old tactics, miners strikes, Iraq war and now student charges. Get yourself a hobby. I blame the teachers. :lol:
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Re: Royal Attack

Postby Bertie » Sat Dec 11, 2010 5:56 pm

But that's exactly the point GG. The actions of a mindless few has taken the focus off of who is at fault and what the protest was all about. The BNP quip wasn't intended to cause offence just to query where do you draw the line
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Re: Royal Attack

Postby Govangirl » Sat Dec 11, 2010 6:02 pm

gizmo wrote:I note Cameron is still the cause of the violence. Although charges were first brought in under Labour, increased by the Tories and agreed to by the Lib/Dems. Indeed it appears the BNP are the only ones you appear to be in agreement with. :D


Agree but Cameron is the only one who can do anything about it.

gizmo wrote:I suppose you are right that only a few of the students were violent thugs and indeed the police were all heavy handed monsters. :roll:


Agree

gizmo wrote:
Does going to Cambridge automatically make you an upper class twit? For someone who agrees protest marches change nothing, you seem to batter on with the same old tactics, miners strikes, Iraq war and now student charges. Get yourself a hobby. I blame the teachers. :lol:


Agree
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Re: Royal Attack

Postby yogino1pup » Sun Dec 12, 2010 7:13 am

who is this twit called Goven Girl?
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Re: Royal Attack

Postby gizmo » Sun Dec 12, 2010 10:49 am

That would be Govan.
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Re: Royal Attack

Postby Govangirl » Sun Dec 12, 2010 10:50 am

No, the twit is called Govangirl
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Re: Royal Attack

Postby gizmo » Sun Dec 12, 2010 1:03 pm

Unless of course Yogi gets mixed up with Cs and Gs. :wink: :lol:
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Re: Royal Attack

Postby Govangirl » Sun Dec 12, 2010 1:05 pm

gizmo wrote:Unless of course Yogi gets mixed up with Cs and Gs. :wink: :lol:


:lol: Probably, that would explain it.
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Re: Royal Attack

Postby ionnsaigh » Sun Dec 12, 2010 3:44 pm

Funny ha ha. :wink:
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Re: Royal Attack

Postby odds » Mon Dec 13, 2010 1:55 am

Govangirl wrote:
Once the student starts earning (not sure of the amount but think it is £15,000) the repayment is then taken out of their wages with an interest rate at 1% above the Bank of England base rate. It’s a myth to suppose that graduates will all earn big money so when they are earning a half-decent wage they will never be able to afford to go on the property ladder as they will be paying back their loans.


As far as I am aware they only pay a percentage out of anything OVER the first £15K that they earn. So for instance if you earn £25k a year the first £15k is not taken into account, so you pay back a percentage of the next £10k. Not sure about the Interest rate you quote though:
Taken from the .gov web site

"How much you have to repay
If you earn less than the threshold or thresholds that apply to you, you don’t have to make any repayments.
Your student loan repayments will be nine per cent of anything you earn over the relevant threshold. Remember that this isn't the same as nine per cent of your total income - you only make repayments on what you earn above the threshold."


"Interest rate from September 2010 to August 2011
The interest rate on income contingent loans will be 1.5 per cent from 1 September 2010 across the UK.
Between 1 September 2010 and 31 August 2011, the interest rate may change because it is linked to the rates charged by high street banks. The rate will be the lower of the Retail Price Index (RPI) in March 2010, or 1 per cent above the highest base rate of a nominated group of banks. As March’s RPI was 4.4 per cent, the maximum rate of interest you may be charged between 1 September 2010 and 31 August 2011 is 4.4 per cent."


http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/EducationAn ... G_10034867

Personally, I think half the people going to university nowadays have very little chance or interest in getting high paying employment, to them it is an adventure away from home paid for by tax payers. I know half a dozen young people that have been to Uni and not one of them earns more than £15k, and these are not thick kids. In todays market labour is cheap, education is expensive.
When you see reports on the TV that students have caused riots, just bear in mind that probably a lot of the people 'protesting' aren't even students, merely thugs activists seeking an opportunity to cause trouble.

Just my 2 penneth.

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Re: Royal Attack

Postby ionnsaigh » Mon Dec 13, 2010 9:17 am

Govangirl, hit the nail on the head. It's impossible to look at recent events in complete isolation.

What I see re: the student protests, is largely Middle Class kids angry, articulate and organised. They and their parents feel badly let down, by the Liberal Party. ( join the company my friends - how do you think we feel about the Labour Party ) Come to think of it, the Labour Party seem pretty tight lipped about recent events, one has to ask, do they have an opinion ? The Trade Unions ( all huff and puff ) should join the protests, after all, we will all feel the coming cuts, one way or another. One thing is for sure, the numbers of protesters will grow, in relation to the discontent felt by many caused by the hands of the few. I found that the level of violence by the police was entirely unacceptable, particularly mounted police charging ordinary kids, participating in their democratic right to protest. A big well done to the Met, you clearly show that you act in the interest of property, before the welfare of people.
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Re: Royal Attack

Postby odds » Mon Dec 13, 2010 9:35 am

ionnsaigh wrote:I found that the level of violence by the police was entirely unacceptable, particularly mounted police charging ordinary kids, participating in their democratic right to protest.


I have to disagree with that statement, 'ordinary kids', and don't forget these are supposedly clever well educated kids, don't go around smashing up windows and wreaking havoc in town centers. The people that cause the problems for the police are the hangers on who will stop at nothing to cause havoc wherever they can.

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